After maaaany years of waiting I FINALLY had the chance to meet and talk to a musician, whom I really admire a lot - Therion Mastermind Christofer Johnsson. The price I paid was high - I had to stand the whole "My Insanity" gig, since I have been waiting for Christofer at the entry of the backstage room…anyways it was really worth it - but read on your own…

Me(phisto): Christofer, it's always a pleasure to see you here in Austria - how is the tour going so far?

Christofer: Very well except Germany - a little bit less people than expected have been showing up there. But overall it's been very good. I mean yesterday we had almost 1100 visitors.

M: With "Secret of the Runes" you wrote your own chapter in the history of music - it is the best symbiose of metal and classical music that was ever performed. Are you satisfied yet or do you think, that it is possible to make even improvements on the next album?

C: Well thank you very much. Of course we are happy, but I think we can do better - I mean every album has to be better than the last album, so that's our aim - every album should be better than the one before.

M: When you thought about integrating symphonic sounds in your music for the first time - did you ever dream about what it is like now?

C: No. Not this far, no. I mean we started very carefully on the second album even with keyboards and stuff, and on the third one we tried to make something classic inspired with samples and keyboards but I didn't think that it would get this far. That's the funny thing with this band. I don't know what's coming around the next corner and that's what I like.

M: How does it actually look with the public acceptance in Sweden? Are you being accepted as artists or is it rather some kind of "just stupid metalheads" attitude?

C: We're not that popular in Sweden, we are pretty well accepted, but Sweden is not really a country were we are doing very well - we don't even get reviews in major press anymore. This is strange, because we sold something like 5000 copies in Sweden but we don't get much attention.

M: Have you thought about performing "Secret of the Runes" at an Opera with orchestra and everything? Or do you think there's no chance for that kind of performance?

C: If we would have the chance to do that, I wouldn't only perform "Secret of the Runes", we would play stuff from the whole bands career. There's a slight chance we might do a concert with an orchestra in South America - Mexico, because we are very popular there, but unfortunately that's very distant from Europe. I am not sure if I wanted to perform in an Opera House - depends on what you mean with an "Opera House" - not in any of these old, nice opera buildings, I think they are not supposed to have rock music there.

M: I think Waltari did something like that…

C:Who?

M: Waltari from Finland.

C: Yeah, but that was a modern opera house - if it's a modern opera house then it's ok, but if it is one of these really old ones with this brilliant acoustic... no, I'm a little bit conservative when it comes to culture - I think Rock Bands should stay out there.

M: Why don't you ever play songs from the first 3 albums live? Do they seem to primitive too you now or is it because they wouldn't fit into the concept…?

C: We are playing them on this tour. The thing is that their sales look very small compared to the newer outputs. From the fans that showed up at the shows - most of them didn't know the old songs - it's pointless to play songs that no one knows. But now we have the re-release of them and they are selling pretty well so that means, that people are interested in and in almost every place they have been working pretty fine.

M: On the - lets call it "band's turning point album" Theli another Swedish sound-magician, Dan Swanö took part - have you ever had some other musical cooperation with him, respective are you having contact to him? Under which circumstances did he come to participate on "Theli"?

C: It was just on this album but we had some contact before. Actually I am a good friend of his wife and so I got to know him, but we don't have much contact now - he lives about 200 km away. He's not doing so much with music at the time - he's working at a music store, selling equipment.

M: I think the last thing he did was this Diabolical Masquerade Sountrack-thing. Have you heard of it?

C: No, I didn't hear about it.

M: Imagine someone coming up to you with a lot of money and tells you "here you are - take it and re-record "Theli" with a real Orchestra" - would you do it?

C: If someone paid for it - sure - why not? But it's not really arranged for an orchestra, it would have to be re-arranged. Violins always play in harmony…it would sound…many of the metal parts would sound less catchy but it would be much bigger. Well but yes, if someone would say "well here…" - I think we would need 50.000 or 60.000 DM therefore - if someone would pay that, why not?

M: If you had the chance to choose - which would be your favourite orchestra for a live performance? Maybe the Vienna Philharmonic Orchestra?

C: Die Wiener Philharmoniker natürlich. The one that Herbert von Karajan used to work with. In my opinion the string players are the best in the world. I think the brass players of the London Symphony Orchestra are very good and there are a lot of other good ones - but I think I would go for the Berliner Philharmoniker, especially because of their history they got a personal value for me.

M: Since Therion sure belongs to the inventors of the idea of integrating classical music into modern sounds - what's your opinion about that nowadays every goddamn hip hopper and pop-musician is recording some kind of classical-mix and is dragging the honour of classical music through the dirt by doing that…?

C: Well that's a typical thing for pop bands - when someone comes up with a good idea they just jump on the wagon. When Metallica did it, The Scorpions had to do it as well. And Metallica probabably did it because they heard "there's something going on in Europe". When it comes to Hip Hop bands it's different, because they don't use strings - they steal from already existing music and that's bad. Warren G did something like that and I think this is not ok, since the original composer would sure not have agreed on this crap. You have to respect the one who created the music. It's actually the same thing with this Austrian guy in HOLLENTHON because he also sampled from existing music - like he stole about one minute from Prokoffief's "Romeo and Julia" - actually it sounds good - we even tried to get them on this tour, because I liked it when I heard it - but I have a few doubts about the method, you know, take someone else's work without asking the author. It's one thing, if you do a cover song - but when you take it and integrate it in your own song - especially when it's that long…as far I know, they don't even have a permission therefore or whatever.

M: Why didn't it work to get them on your tour? (…because about everything would have been better than "My Insanity"…)

C: They asked for too much money.

M: When Metallica brought out their rather weak "S & M" album, Lars Ulrich said "we're the first metal band, that tried to bring together metal and classical music" - aren't you kinda pissed off, when you hear something like that?

C: What can you expect of someone who has been on cocaine for the last 10 years? In his world there's probably no progression since they did the "Black Album". This sort of Band probably doesn't have a personal clue - I think maybe there's a manager or someone who told them "ok, there's something going on in Europe, you have to do this" - then of course someone like Lars is not aware of it - I mean he's just a drummer, he hasn't got a clue.

M: Not even a good one…

C: No, not even a good one - he never was and he never will be. But this is typical. In any case we where not the first ones either. Celtic Frost did it in '87, even though they did it very small-scaled. They had a French Horn, a Tono Soprano. But the whole Idea…with Rock music…this is very old. I mean Pink Floyd did it in 1970- this was one of my inspirations for getting the idea. There where so many symphonic Rock Bands in the 70s, and Krautrock-Bands, that did it - bands like "Eloy". So the whole idea is not new. If you go back to the origin, I think the "Moody Blues" was one of the very first ones - I think in 1967 they did this concept album - it was called something like "In days of future past" - this is a very good album and they where definitely one of the very first bands who did it.

M: But I think Therion was the first band, that did that with real metal music.

C: Yeah, in big scales - we were not the first ones to come up with that idea, but we where the first ones who did it in big scales. But we are still the only ones who have replaced the concept of having a lead singer with the choir. I think that the other bands - for them it's like a sandwich - they make the metal music and they put the cheese upon it. But for me it doesn't work that way. If you remove the metal parts of a Therion-song, what remains is not really classical and if you would remove the classical parts, it wouldn't be a metal song either, it would just be some background riffing - because it's composed for both from the beginning. We try to integrate the guitars, the bass and the drums in a way that they are just some more instruments in the usual orchestra. I think not so many other bands dare to do that. Lot of others might want it, but they don't have the budget. With less than 50.000 € we couldn't make a new album.

M: Have you heard Lacrimosa?

C: They are good, I like them.

M: And what about Haggard? Do you know them?

C: Yeah, from Bayern. They are also good - they are doing a very different thing - it's like very early Barock and medieval sounds. Lacrimosa are more influenced by the typical classic style like Beethoven…

M: I talked to Tilo Wolff from Lacrimosa some weeks ago, he said, that he's mostly inspired by Mozart…

C: But I think also Beethoven, because I heard one of their songs that reminded me very much of Beethoven's Fifth…I don't like that era very much - I mean I like some works of Beethoven, for me it's Wagner. Wagner, Richard Strauß...but especially Wagner - he had the best melodies and as well the most power and energy. He also made interesting Librettos, you know it's not only good music, the stories are interesting too.

M: I like Händel a lot…

C: Yeah, he's good as well - I mean I like it, but it's not really what I am listening to a lot.

M: Which was your first metal gig?

C: That I have been to?

M: Yeah.

C: I think it must have been the "Monsters of Rock" '85…it was with Scorpions, Ozzy Osbourne,…

M: And which are your favourite 5 albums?

C: On the first place I would put my favourite opera from Wagner - "Rienzi". Most people oversee his early works. Especially "Die Feen" and "Liebesverbot". I think Rienzi is really great. If I could take one CD with me to a desert island - actually it's 3 CD's, but if I could take one piece of music with me, this would be the only one to listen to all the time.

M: And what about Metal? Which are your favourite bands?

C: Accept, Judas Priest, Iron Maiden…I like a lot of seventies-stuff - well they are not quite metal, but I like Uriah Heep, Deep Purple, Black Sabbath and stuff like that. From the 90s I don't like so much band - just Voivod is a really good band, I like Voivod. And I like Amorphis a lot, they are really good. The Gathering is good as well.

M: That was my first Metal gig - Therion with Amorphis on the Theli-Tour.

C: We didn't play so well, but the Tour was fun.

M: I was totally dead after that gig.

C: I think we didn't sound very good on that tour - we had bad singers with us and we where constantly drinking before the shows. When I heard a tape of one of these shows I stopped drinking before the shows (laughs).

M: I think my favourite club-gig so far (what does not include the latest show 3;-)…) was on the tour with Crematory, Lake of Tears and Dark.

C: Yes, that was a good show…

M: When you played "Under Jolly Roger" as last song together with musicians of the other bands, that was really cool! .. I've read that you are a member of the "dragon rouge" order- so my next question is - what kind of religious attitude do you have?

C: I am not a religious person, but I accept all spiritual elements, you know you can always learn a lot of things from different religions, when it comes to philosophy and practical things, but I don't believe in the idea of submission. This is a pretty complicated question to answer that quickly.

M: Do you believe in something like a god?

C: Not in a normal religious way - I don't believe in monotheism for example. I don't believe in the strict duality, Black and White.

M: Do you think there is anything worst than Harry Potter?

C: I never read any of those books, so I don't have any comments. Actually it's better when people read anything like that. You know, when people read, then it's good. When they read and don't watch television.

M: But there are a lot of better Fantasy Books than "Harry Potter" - the Lord of the Rings for example…

C: Yeah, but maybe they continue with Lord of the Rings…I mean at least they are reading! I mean the Libraries are turning into museums for books. People don't go there to read anymore - that's pretty sad actually - so if they read anything I think it's a good thing instead of watching Stefan Raab and stuff like that.

M: Well, Talk-Shows are even worse…

C: Yeah - as long as they read it's good…

M: Do you have any hobbies besides music - which is actually your profession as well?

C: I like to read a lot. And I like to watch old movies like "Metropolis". I like to spend time in the nature too. I like hiking - actually I spend a lot of time in Oberbayern and also Austria - I like the Mountains.

M: So you are here more often then expected…

C: Yes, every summer - Austria, Switzerland - it's very nice in the mountainside. I mean I am thinking of living 50:50 there, probably on the Austrian side, because it's so fucking expensive in Bayern.

M: Have you ever been recognized when you have been hiking there?

C: No, I don't think so. I think that most of the "Freiluftmenschen" and Tourists don't listen to our albums.

M: What do you think which invention should have never been made?

C: Very good question…gun powder.

M: Are there any last words from you to our readers?

C: It's nice to be back in Austria - it's always a pleasure to be here. It's a beautiful country and we like to play here.

M: Thank you very much!

Mephisto